From: Cyranomish@aol.com
Date:Fri, 1 Aug 1997 07:35:27 -0400 (EDT)
To:jco@usfca.edu
Subject:adult ed JCO course in Cambridge Mass.

There's going to be a course on "Joyce Carol Oates: Mainly Short Stories" at
the Cambridge Center for Adult Education in Harvard Square starting August
13.
It meets 5:45 - 7:15 on Wednesday, for 6 weeks.  For further info call (617)
547-6789 or  fax (617) 497-7532.  email in registration@ccae.org.  They'll be
reading "them" too. ---------Cyrano



From: Cyranomish@aol.com
Date:  Sun, 3 Aug 1997 10:08:08 -0400 (EDT)
To: jco@usfca.edu
Subject:  Rosamond Smith "concept novel"

There's something that's puzzled me for some time.  What, exactly, is a
"concept novel"?  When I first heard the term applied to RS novels, I thought
it meant a novel that is streamlined down to a one or two, simple,
clearly-defined themes.  "Snake Eyes," however, was such a complex, alusive
work -- and the murderer's identity established in

such a slanted way, that I couldn't call that simple at all.  The RS novels
all seem to be narrated in a distinctly mannered voice -- somewhat sardonic,
like "Expensive People,"
way back in the 60s.  Also the character names seem somewhat jokey, like
Molly Marks, the heroine of the first RS novel "Lives of the Twins."  as
though we were reading an allegory about "Christian" or "Mr. Worldly
Wiseman."  If anybody has some thoughts on this, I'd appreciate hearing them.
 Also, what are some other, non-JCO, examples of concept novel?   Thanks.
 Cyrano



From: Elektra200@aol.com
Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 13:40:24 -0400 (EDT)
To: jco@usfca.edu
Subject:  New

Hi all....I'm new on the discussion list, so I'm not even sure how many
people participate in this. I have been a fan of Joyce Carol Oates for a year
or more now -- so far I've read Zombie, American Appeties, Because it is
Bitter, What I lived for, You Must Remember This, Foxfire, We Were the
Mulvaneys, Expensive People, Will you ALways Love me?and Wonderland. I am
really excited about participating in discussion about this amazing writer.
Jen



From:  Cyranomish@aol.com
Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 14:32:49 -0400 (EDT)
To: jco@usfca.edu
Subject: Welcome, Jen

Hi, you've sure read a lot in one year, but don't forget the short stories.
 I think "Heat"
has some of my favorites, although the lastest one "Will You Always Love Me?"
has a lot of great ones too.  There's also a story in last winter's "Kenyon
Review" magazine called "Faithless" which astonished me.  It's a great tale
of how families adjust their views of reality in order to survive -- a big
Oates theme.  Hope you enjoy this webpage. ---------------- Cyrano



From: Elektra200@aol.com
Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 16:10:44 -0400 (EDT)
To:jco@usfca.edu
Subject: Re: Welcome, Jen

Thanks for the welcome. As of now, AMerican Appetites is my favorite.

ALso, an announcement for any AOL users....I host the New York Times' Book
Chat (or at least I will be hosting it until I leave for college the 1st week
of Sept.) and I would love to see people there ....to access go to keyword
NYT Chat and click on Book Chat - it is Wed nights from 10 pm - 12. On Wed we
will be having a guest (I won't be there next week, but my cohost Elicoh will
be there). Please join us if you can.



Date:  Fri, 08 Aug 1997 23:03:02 -0400
From:  "Thomas A. Hulslander" t-hulslander@top.monad.net
To:  jco@usfca.edu
Subject:  Re: New

Elektra200@aol.com wrote:
> 
> Hi all....I'm new on the discussion list, so I'm not even sure how many
> people participate in this. I have been a fan of Joyce Carol Oates for a year
> or more now -- so far I've read Zombie, American Appeties, Because it is
> Bitter, What I lived for, You Must Remember This, Foxfire, We Were the
> Mulvaneys, Expensive People, Will you ALways Love me?and Wonderland. I am
> really excited about participating in discussion about this amazing writer.
> Jen

 Welcome, Jen-
 I hope you enjoy the discussions regarding JCO- I know that I do-it is
fun to share ideas and insights about her work.
Yake care-
Krista



Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 12:07:37 -0400 (EDT)
From: Bruce Edelman bedelman@epfl2.epflbalto.org
To: jco@usfca.edu
Subject: Re: New

On Fri, 8 Aug 1997 Elektra200@aol.com wrote:

> Hi all....I'm new on the discussion list, so I'm not even sure how many
> people participate in this. I have been a fan of Joyce Carol Oates for a year
> or more now -- so far I've read Zombie, American Appeties, Because it is
> Bitter, What I lived for, You Must Remember This, Foxfire, We Were the
> Mulvaneys, Expensive People, Will you ALways Love me?and Wonderland. I am
> really excited about participating in discussion about this amazing writer.
> Jen
> 
Hi,
  
   I also just joined the discussion.  Also like Jen, I recently became
fascinated by the novels of JCO and have been reading them one after the
other.  I've read most of the ones listed.  I thought "What I Lived For" 
was impressive.  I was not as taken with "Them".  Some parts of it just
didn't strike me as real or representative.  In any case, there is
something about her novels which keeps us reading.  I think, for one
thing, that she has amazing insight into human nature. 

Bruce



From: JonWendell@webtv.net (John Eggers)
Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 12:30:04 -0500
To: jco@usfca.edu
Subject: Re: New


 There seems to be quite a few people on this
list,  it just seems to go in spurts.  I have also
read most of the JCO novels,  (excluding Childwold,  Cybele,  A
Garden...,  Unholy Loves), a great many short story collections,
essays, and poems.  My favorite novels are
the genre novels-Bellefleur, A Bloodsmoor Romance, and Mysteries of
Winterthurn.  Not
as many people comment on or have read this
trilogy.  Works of genius!!   I am also a big fan
of  "The Assasins".  I hope the posts pick up
after the publication of "Man Crazy"



Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 13:47:01 -0400 (EDT)
From:  "Matthew A. Cheney" mac5519@is.NYU.EDU
To:  jco@usfca.edu
Subject:  "Faithless"


There have been some passing mentions of Oates's recent story in The
Kenyon Review, "Faithless" -- how many of you out there have read it?  I
just read it, after finishing WE WERE THE MULVANEYS last night, and will
say that the two together are quite a powerful combination.  Oates's
Chautauqua Valley is as vivid and multilayered as Faulkner's
Yoknapatawpha.  (A question for those of you who have read much more of
Oates than I: do characters and/or families reappear throughout the
Chautauqua books and stories, or just settings and themes?)

The magical quality of Oates's best writing, for me, is her attention to
detail and her ability to create lifelike characters and scenes with a
careful selection of details (often so sensory: who could not smell the
bedroom in "Faithless"?)  While few good, or even just-plain-okay, stories
are not detail-laden, Oates is a master of figuring out what details
contribute not only to our sense of a scene, but to the tale as a whole:
we learn from the description of the bedroom so much about the characters
and their situations, and the smells and sights described contribute to
the overall "mood".  By such careful construction, Oates is able to fit
into a 19-page story more life than many authors have put in 500-page
novels.

MULVANEYS proves that when she puts her talent to 500-(well, 454-)pages,
the depth and richness of the settings, characters, and emotion are
overpowering.  Leaving aside all of the aspects of the book I haven't even
begun to think about, my immediate reaction is: I know the Mulvaney
family, and I have lived in the Chautauqua Valley (though in reality I've
only driven through).  My next reaction is: she'd better get the Pulitzer
this time!

Matthew Cheney



From: Elektra200@aol.com
Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 15:11:42 -0400 (EDT)
To:  jco@usfca.edu
Subject:  Re: New

In a message dated 97-08-11 15:05:52 EDT, you write:

<<  I have also
 read most of the JCO novels,  (excluding Childwold,  Cybele,  A
 Garden...,  Unholy Loves), a great many short story collections,
 essays, and poems.  >>

Then, let me ask you,  what did you think of Wonderland? Of all of her
novels, it is the one that makes me feel the most removed. Usually, I find
myself absorbed in the writing, but while reading this one, I truly felt like
an outsider. 

Curious to hear what other people thought.
Also, nice to know there are people on this list who post!!!!
Jen



Date:  Mon, 11 Aug 1997 16:12:59 -0400
From:  "Thomas A. Hulslander" t-hulslander@top.monad.net
To:  jco@usfca.edu
Subject: Re: New

Bruce Edelman wrote:
> 
> On Fri, 8 Aug 1997 Elektra200@aol.com wrote:
> 
> > Hi all....I'm new on the discussion list, so I'm not even sure how many
> > people participate in this. I have been a fan of Joyce Carol Oates for a year
> > or more now -- so far I've read Zombie, American Appeties, Because it is
> > Bitter, What I lived for, You Must Remember This, Foxfire, We Were the
> > Mulvaneys, Expensive People, Will you ALways Love me?and Wonderland. I am
> > really excited about participating in discussion about this amazing writer.
> > Jen
> >
> Hi,
> 
>    I also just joined the discussion.  Also like Jen, I recently became
> fascinated by the novels of JCO and have been reading them one after the
> other.  I've read most of the ones listed.  I thought "What I Lived For"
> was impressive.  I was not as taken with "Them".  Some parts of it just
> didn't strike me as real or representative.  In any case, there is
> something about her novels which keeps us reading.  I think, for one
> thing, that she has amazing insight into human nature.
> 
> Bruce
Welcome, Bruce!

It is great to see so many JCo readers online!  I agree with you, about
JCO's insight into human nature.  Her characters are multi-dimensional,
like real people living through real-life experiences.  By delving into
the "dark side" of the human experience, she opens a doorway for the
reader, to see and wonder about our own tendencies, and reactions.
        For example, in "We Were the Mulvaneys", we see a family self-destruct
after one horrific experience.  The way JCO weaves a story through each
family member's fury leaves the reader with an intimate knowledge of
each psyche within the family.
        "them" has been my favorite novel so far, I read it once a year, at
least!  The human ability to endure and survive I think rang very true,
even if some of the events seemed unreal.
        I hope you enjoy the discussions!
Krista



Date:  Mon, 11 Aug 1997 16:20:30 -0400
 From:  "Thomas A. Hulslander" t-hulslander@top.monad.net
To:  jco@usfca.edu
Subject: Re: "Faithless"

Matthew A. Cheney wrote:
> 
> There have been some passing mentions of Oates's recent story in The
> Kenyon Review, "Faithless" -- how many of you out there have read it?  I
> just read it, after finishing WE WERE THE MULVANEYS last night, and will
> say that the two together are quite a powerful combination.  Oates's
> Chautauqua Valley is as vivid and multilayered as Faulkner's
> Yoknapatawpha.  (A question for those of you who have read much more of
> Oates than I: do characters and/or families reappear throughout the
> Chautauqua books and stories, or just settings and themes?)
> 
> The magical quality of Oates's best writing, for me, is her attention to
> detail and her ability to create lifelike characters and scenes with a
> careful selection of details (often so sensory: who could not smell the
> bedroom in "Faithless"?)  While few good, or even just-plain-okay, stories
> are not detail-laden, Oates is a master of figuring out what details
> contribute not only to our sense of a scene, but to the tale as a whole:
> we learn from the description of the bedroom so much about the characters
> and their situations, and the smells and sights described contribute to
> the overall "mood".  By such careful construction, Oates is able to fit
> into a 19-page story more life than many authors have put in 500-page
> novels.
> 
> MULVANEYS proves that when she puts her talent to 500-(well, 454-)pages,
> the depth and richness of the settings, characters, and emotion are
> overpowering.  Leaving aside all of the aspects of the book I haven't even
> begun to think about, my immediate reaction is: I know the Mulvaney
> family, and I have lived in the Chautauqua Valley (though in reality I've
> only driven through).  My next reaction is: she'd better get the Pulitzer
> this time!
> 
> Matthew Cheney

Matthew,
I have not yet had a chance to read "Faithless", my library here in town
does not subscribe!  Does anyone know if they have an on-line
publication?  I have heard so many good things about the story, I am
anxious to read it.
I came away from "Mulvaneys" with the same thoughts, Matthew, I felt I
knew the whole clan-(I felt, in some parts of the book,that she was
writing about my family!).  The details and impressions she gives of the
Chautauqua Valley leave a lasting impression.  I have seen the area
appear in other works of hers, but I do not recall any of the same
characters re-appearing.  
I have read the "Mulvaneys" twice, and each time I find something new
and startling-the same thing happens when I read "them".  
Take care-
Krista



Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 16:23:37 -0400
 From:  "Thomas A. Hulslander" t-hulslander@top.monad.net
To: jco@usfca.edu
Subject:  Re: New

John Eggers wrote:
> 
>  There seems to be quite a few people on this
> list,  it just seems to go in spurts.  I have also
> read most of the JCO novels,  (excluding Childwold,  Cybele,  A
> Garden...,  Unholy Loves), a great many short story collections,
> essays, and poems.  My favorite novels are
> the genre novels-Bellefleur, A Bloodsmoor Romance, and Mysteries of
> Winterthurn.  Not
> as many people comment on or have read this
> trilogy.  Works of genius!!   I am also a big fan
> of  "The Assasins".  I hope the posts pick up
> after the publication of "Man Crazy"

I too have read "Bellefleur" and "A Bloodsmore Romance", I have yet to
read "Mysteries of Winterthurn."  It is on my list!
When does "Man Crazy" come out, by the way?



From: Gary Couzens gjcouzens@btinternet.com
To: "'Joyce Carol Oates Discussion List'" jco@usfca.edu
Subject: JCO Film Adaptations
Date:  Mon, 11 Aug 1997 18:50:24 +-100

Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 16:30:08 -0400
From:  "Thomas A. Hulslander" 
To: jco@usfca.edu
 Subject:  Re: JCO Film Adaptations

Gary Couzens wrote:
> 

gary-
I have yet to see any JCO film adaptations; I have not sought any out at
the local video store, because I am usually disappointed in film based
on a writer's work-so much of the emotion and passion seems to get lost
in the translation!
I have heard some good things about the Laura Dern movie, I think it was
based on "Where are you going, where have you been?"  
I seem to remember hearing a story about another work of JCO's being
adapted into fil-but I can't remember the title.
Take care, 
Krista



From:  Elektra200@aol.com
Date:Mon, 11 Aug 1997 17:03:10 -0400 (EDT)
To:  jco@usfca.edu
Subject: Re: JCO Film Adaptations

In a message dated 97-08-11 16:28:34 EDT, you write:

<< The film version of Foxfire, made a couple of years ago, hasn't been shown
over here.  Has anyone seen it and is it any good? >>

I didn't even know there was a film version of Foxfire.....



From:  Doozer411@aol.com
 Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 17:29:22 -0400 (EDT)
To: jco@usfca.edu
Subject: Re: JCO Film Adaptations

Gary-
  Foxfire came out last year, and it was ABSOLUTELY AWFUL!!!!!!!  Don't even
bother with it.  I can't even express how disappointed I was with it.  I saw
it in the theater right after I finished the book- one of Oates' best, in my
opinion (except the very end, which I was a little bothered by).  Anyway, the
film version was terrible, the plot, characters, and time completely altered,
marred by crappy, alternative music.  It was a shitty nineties version (the
book takes place in the fifties, as many of her novels do), and it left much
to be desired.  
                                                              -Lindsay
Goldman 



Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 21:38:25 +0000
From: SHELLYE SHELLYE@Prodigy.Net
To:  jco@usfca.edu
 Subject: Re: JCO Film Adaptations

Elektra200@aol.com wrote:
> 
> In a message dated 97-08-11 16:28:34 EDT, you write:
> 
> << The film version of Foxfire, made a couple of years ago, hasn't been shown
> over here.  Has anyone seen it and is it any good? >>
> 
> I didn't even know there was a film version of Foxfire.....


I've been away for awhile, and it is not often that i post but i did see
foxfire and thought it was awful.  I have not yet read the book, though
i do own it--i think i have to wait until the movie is out of my head. 
Curious to see what others think...
shellye



Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 18:25:20 -0700
To:  jco@usfca.edu
 From:  Nikki Senecal senecal@scf-fs.usc.edu
Subject:  Re: JCO Film Adaptations

>In a message dated 97-08-11 16:28:34 EDT, you write:
>
><< The film version of Foxfire, made a couple of years ago, hasn't been shown
>over here.  Has anyone seen it and is it any good? >>
>
>I didn't even know there was a film version of Foxfire.....

It's terrible.  The list of changes begins with Legs being a stranger in
town, rather than someone who is a known quantity in the community.  The
girls are middle (upper) rather than working class.  Goldie's father is
kidnapped, rather than their kidnapping the "capitalist".  All the Marxist
material is omitted.  Goldie is Asian and is a drug addict.  There is no
hooking in the film.  When the girls are being "punished" when Legs goes to
juvvie, they communicate by email.  I could go on and on.

The film version has very little to do with the book; although, for me,
writing about violent women in American culture and literature from a
feminist perspective, I think in some ways the changes reflect the schism
between 60s/70s feminism represented in the book and Naomi Wolf's power
feminism represented in the movie.  I have been told that this is a
generous reading.  Oates did work on the film adaptation, though.

Nikki



Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 23:03:44 -0400
From:  "Thomas A. Hulslander" t-hulslander@top.monad.net
To:  jco@usfca.edu
Subject: Re: JCO Film Adaptations

SHELLYE wrote:
> 
> Elektra200@aol.com wrote:
> >
> > In a message dated 97-08-11 16:28:34 EDT, you write:
> >
> > << The film version of Foxfire, made a couple of years ago, hasn't been shown
> > over here.  Has anyone seen it and is it any good? >>
> >
> > I didn't even know there was a film version of Foxfire.....
> 
> I've been away for awhile, and it is not often that i post but i did see
> foxfire and thought it was awful.  I have not yet read the book, though
> i do own it--i think i have to wait until the movie is out of my head.
> Curious to see what others think...
> shellye

Shellye-
Foxfire is an excellent book, and you should read it-I have not seen the
movie version, but from what I've heard, it had little to do with the
plot/characters/essence of the book.  So, maybe if you read the book,
you can banish the film from your mind!
Take care,
Krista



From: Elektra200@aol.com
 Date: Tue, 12 Aug 1997 10:00:56 -0400 (EDT)
To:  jco@usfca.edu
Subject: Re: JCO Film Adaptations

In a message dated 97-08-12 09:55:17 EDT, you write:

<< I have not yet read the book, though
 i do own it- >>

Everyone should read Foxfire - it really is one of her best. Don't let what
sounds like a horrible movie put you off from reading the book.

Jen



From: JonWendell@webtv.net (John Eggers)
Date: Tue, 12 Aug 1997 12:37:36 -0500
To: jco@usfca.edu
Subject: Re: Man Crazy

JCO's new novel  is scheduled for release September 1st.   There is a
brief review of the book (Kirkus review, I think?) at Amazon Books.



From: nhunter@fsc.follett.com
 Date:  Tue, 12 Aug 97 15:00:33 CDT
To:  jco@usfca.edu
Subject: Very New!

     Hello All-
     I am extremely new, not only to this group, but also to Joyce Carol 
     Oates. I am genuinly happy to have found the "Celestial Timepiece" 
     page! I had never read anything by JCO until I found the page and 
     started reading the bits and pieces of her work. 
     Just so you know how new I am to JCO, I have only read the short story 
     "Accursed Inhabitants Of The House Of Bly", and the book "The Rise of 
     Life on Earth". I am currently in the middle of "Them". 
     In a few short weeks I have become addicted to her writing. She really 
     pulls you into other worlds. Her descriptions of people, places and 
     especially feelings and emotions are incredible. I can't put her work 
     down once I begin.
     I look forward to reading more of her work, and being a part of this 
     discussion group. Just reading the last few posts has given me ideas 
     for what to read next! -- If I can find them!!
     Thanks for opening my eyes to a new "favorite" author.
     
     - Nancy




Date:  Wed, 13 Aug 1997 09:14:54 -0400
From: "Thomas A. Hulslander" t-hulslander@top.monad.net
To:  jco@usfca.edu
Subject:  Re: Very New!

nhunter@fsc.follett.com wrote:
> 
>      Hello All-
>      I am extremely new, not only to this group, but also to Joyce Carol
>      Oates. I am genuinly happy to have found the "Celestial Timepiece"
>      page! I had never read anything by JCO until I found the page and
>      started reading the bits and pieces of her work.
>      Just so you know how new I am to JCO, I have only read the short story
>      "Accursed Inhabitants Of The House Of Bly", and the book "The Rise of
>      Life on Earth". I am currently in the middle of "Them".
>      In a few short weeks I have become addicted to her writing. She really
>      pulls you into other worlds. Her descriptions of people, places and
>      especially feelings and emotions are incredible. I can't put her work
>      down once I begin.
>      I look forward to reading more of her work, and being a part of this
>      discussion group. Just reading the last few posts has given me ideas
>      for what to read next! -- If I can find them!!
>      Thanks for opening my eyes to a new "favorite" author.
> 
>      - Nancy


Welcome, Nancy!
"them" is one of my favorites-I re-read it every so often, because the
characters are so compelling!  I'm glad you've discovered JCO, and the
Timepiece page.  I had trouble finding some of her works, but I just
made a list and asked my librarian to get them!
Have fun reading & take care,
Krista



From: Doozer411@aol.com
Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 23:06:49 -0400 (EDT)
To: jco@usfca.edu
Subject: Re: Very New!

Nancy-
  Hello. I'm glad you've discovered JCO. I have been a fanatic for about two
years now and have recently completed a year long study of some of her more
recent less critiqued works.  I'm curious to know how you liked The Rise of
Life...; it is definitely one of her less popular novels which many have
disliked.  Personally, though, it is one of my favorites.  I also recommend Yo
u Must Remember This (my all-time favorite), Solstice, and Foxfire.  
                                                         -Lindsay



From: Doozer411@aol.com
Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 23:09:34 -0400 (EDT)
To: jco@usfca.edu
Subject: NAKED!

Hello fellow Oates freaks!  I was wondering if anyone has read her short
story, "Naked" from the collection entitled Heat.  I believe this to be one
of her major works of genius and was wondering if anyone else thought the
same. 



From:  nhunter@fsc.follett.com
Date: Thu, 14 Aug 97 07:57:57 CDT
To: jco@usfca.edu
Subject:  Re[2]: Very New!

     Lindsay-
     I thought The Rise of Life on Earth was fantastic! I can't believe it 
     is one of her least popular novels. I was hooked the moment I started 
     reading, and I literally did not put it down until I was finished!! 
     Thanks for the ideas on my next reading. I'm trying to find a copy of 
     Foxfire. My library doesn't have a copy, but I'm still checking.
                                                        -Nancy



Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 10:44:09 -0400 (EDT)
From:  Bruce Edelman 
To:  jco@usfca.edu
Subject: American Appetites

Hi,

I thought that the detailed descriptions of the people and setting are, as 
usual, very telling.  I think the novel effectively presents Ian's 
confusion over the fears and desires that arise in himself and others.

I'll have to read it again, however, because I didn't fully understand 
Ian and his concerns.  Did I understand right that at the end Ian is also 
dissatisfied with Sigrid, and that she is turning out to be not much 
different from Glynnis?  How seriously are we to take Ian's philosophical 
inquiries?  Has he learned much from his trials?

I particularly enjoyed the vivid characters Meika and Nick.  It is 
fitting that they get together and move to a glass tower in Manhattan.

Bruce



Date:  Thu, 14 Aug 1997 11:03:36 -0400 (EDT)
From:   "Matthew A. Cheney" 
To:  jco@usfca.edu
Subject: Re: Re[2]: Very New!

On Thu, 14 Aug 1997 nhunter@fsc.follett.com wrote:

>      Lindsay-
>      I thought The Rise of Life on Earth was fantastic! I can't believe it 
>      is one of her least popular novels. I was hooked the moment I started 
>      reading, and I literally did not put it down until I was finished!! 
>      Thanks for the ideas on my next reading. I'm trying to find a copy of 
>      Foxfire. My library doesn't have a copy, but I'm still checking.
>                                                         -Nancy

Nancy--

I don't know where in the real world you are, but if you're near a Barnes
& Noble, they may have a remaindered hardcover of FOXFIRE for about $6.
It's at that stage in its life where the warehouses are trying to unload
the hardcovers, so it may be at other bookstores that have remaindered
books, too.  Happy hunting!

--Matt Cheney



From:  nhunter@fsc.follett.com
Date:Thu, 14 Aug 97 10:37:30 CDT
To: jco@usfca.edu
Subject:Barnes & Nobel

     Matt-
     I Live in hicksville USA!! The closest Barnes & Noble is approx. 60 
     miles from me. I do have a walden books approx 30 miles away, so I 
     will give it a try 1st, then I will make the trek to Barnes & Noble if 
     I have no luck. Thank You!
     Nancy

 


From: ken_y@primenet.com
Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 22:15:21 -0700
To: jco@usfca.edu
Subject:  Re: JCO Film Adaptations


I always wonder when I see a poor film adaptation of a book by a living
author.

I assume that Ms. Oates had some involvement in the film, that she saw the
final version, that it was released with her approval (I don't remember any
press about her raising any objections to the film's release).

So is there something there that we're missing?  Could the film version
truly reflect Ms. Oates' vision of what Foxfire would be if it were recast
to the 90s?  Did she see it as a work unto itself, and, therefore,
comparisons with the book are inappropriate?  Or is it just the money...

     ---==>Ken


Date:  Fri, 15 Aug 1997 08:35:06 -0400 (EDT)
 From:  "Matthew A. Cheney" 
To: jco@usfca.edu
Subject: Re: JCO Film Adaptations

On Thu, 14 Aug 1997 ken_y@primenet.com wrote:

> I always wonder when I see a poor film adaptation of a book by a living
> author.
> 
> I assume that Ms. Oates had some involvement in the film, that she saw the
> final version, that it was released with her approval (I don't remember any
> press about her raising any objections to the film's release).
> 
> So is there something there that we're missing?  Could the film version
> truly reflect Ms. Oates' vision of what Foxfire would be if it were recast
> to the 90s?  Did she see it as a work unto itself, and, therefore,
> comparisons with the book are inappropriate?  Or is it just the money...
> 
>      ---==>Ken
> 
> 
> 
My guess is Oates probably didn't have any involvement, and may not have
even gotten to see the movie until about the time it was released.
Authors and screenwriters are not important people to movies --
screenwriters don't even get the copyright to their scripts, the studio
does.  Most films usually have more than one screenwriter, too, no matter
how many names appear in the credits (an example is 'The American
President', the original script for which was written in the early
seventies, and then worked on by about twenty people until it was released
a year or two ago).  Sometimes even directors don't have the final say in
how a movie comes out -- Robert Altman is currently trying to have his
name removed from a new movie which the studio hired someone to re-edit
after Altman turned in his final cut.  Compared to the author of the
"source material", though, the screenwriter has power.  The only thing for
the author to do in order to avoid a nervous breakdown is to take the
money and run.

--Matt



From: Cyranomish@aol.com
Date:  Fri, 15 Aug 1997 09:34:42 -0400 (EDT)
To:  jco@usfca.edu
Subject:  Re: NAKED!


Yes, I re-read "Naked" a couple of months ago.  Although it isn't among my
favorites, I
think it's very good, and I've used it in a class I've taught -- the students
had fairly
stong responses to it.  I liked the way it makes us understand what it would
be like to be suddenly -- literally -- stripped of many of the things that
make us what we are.  The tactile sense of roaming through the woods in the
buff was of course very well done.  I particularly enjoyed the encounter with
the dog -- suddenly we're back at the dawn of history, fending off animals
with a stick...but with Oates this experience goes way back:
"Upon the Sweeping Flood" in the collection of the same name also shows how
rapidly the veneer of civilization can get swept away.  Cyrano



From: Cyranomish@aol.com
Date:  Fri, 15 Aug 1997 09:44:37 -0400 (EDT)
To: jco@usfca.edu
 Subject:  Re: JCO Film Adaptations

I really want to see this Foxfire movie.  It was in Boston for about a week.
 As soon as I saw a still of the actresses on the JCO home page, I realized
it had been reset to a cheesy 90s era.  The charm of the book to me was all
the 50s stuff, so I hesitated and missed out.  Last time I checked the video
store -- 4 or more months ago, it wasn't out yet.  Re: Oate's participation
-- I once got to interview Robert Stone, and he had a neat remark to sum up
the adaptation of his "Dog Soldiers"  to the Nick Nolte film "Who'll Stop the
Rain"   -- Stone said -- "Selling the filmrights is like selling a horse,
once it's gone it's gone."  There's one Oates adaptation I'm trying to track
down.  Can anyone help me?  It's a short feature of "In a Region of Ice."  My
stepsister who teaches high school in New Jersey has seen it in classes, but
I can't find it so far.  I did read some critical blurb on it in some film
book that called it well done and interesting.   Cyrano



Date: Fri, 15 Aug 1997 07:38:16 -0700
To: jco@usfca.edu
From:  Nikki Senecal 
Subject:  Re: NAKED!

Cyrano wrote
>Yes, I re-read "Naked" a couple of months ago.  Although it isn't among my
>favorites, I think it's very good, and I've used it in a class I've taught
>-- the students had fairly stong responses to it.  I liked the way it makes
>us understand what it would be like to be suddenly -- literally --
>stripped of many of the things that make us what we are.  The tactile
>sense of roaming through the woods in the buff was of course very well
>done.  I particularly enjoyed the encounter with the dog -- suddenly we're
>back at the dawn of history, fending off animals with a stick


I read this story a bit more ironically than you.  She is, afterall, in a
"suburban wildlife preserve."

Nikki



From: Doozer411@aol.com
Date: Fri, 15 Aug 1997 11:25:18 -0400 (EDT)
To: jco@usfca.edu
Subject:  Re: JCO Film Adaptations

Ken-
  When I saw Ms. Oates speak in September, she basically admitted that
Foxfire was a flop.  I don't really know what happened there (it was god
awful), but I do know that she was involved in the process to a certain
extent.  I don't think that was her vision, though, and if it was, she seemed
to have realized that it was an incorrect one.
                                  -Lindsay



Date: Fri, 15 Aug 1997 13:15:31 -0400
 From:  "Thomas A. Hulslander" t-hulslander@top.monad.net
To: jco@usfca.edu
Subject:  Re: JCO Film Adaptations

Cyranomish@aol.com wrote:
> 
> I really want to see this Foxfire movie.  It was in Boston for about a week.
>  As soon as I saw a still of the actresses on the JCO home page, I realized
> it had been reset to a cheesy 90s era.  The charm of the book to me was all
> the 50s stuff, so I hesitated and missed out.  Last time I checked the video
> store -- 4 or more months ago, it wasn't out yet.  Re: Oate's participation
> -- I once got to interview Robert Stone, and he had a neat remark to sum up
> the adaptation of his "Dog Soldiers"  to the Nick Nolte film "Who'll Stop the
> Rain"   -- Stone said -- "Selling the filmrights is like selling a horse,
> once it's gone it's gone."  There's one Oates adaptation I'm trying to track
> down.  Can anyone help me?  It's a short feature of "In a Region of Ice."  My
> stepsister who teaches high school in New Jersey has seen it in classes, but
> I can't find it so far.  I did read some critical blurb on it in some film
> book that called it well done and interesting.   Cyrano

I have seen the "In the Region Of Ice" movie-a short movie if I remember
correctly-on my local PBS station.  Perhaps if you contacted them, or
visited your local station's web site, they could give you some
information.
Krista



From:  RJohn713@aol.com
Date: Fri, 15 Aug 1997 14:35:13 -0400 (EDT)
To:  jco@usfca.edu
Subject:  Re: JCO Film Adaptations


I don't believe that JCO had any involvement in the film adaptation of
FOXFIRE.  I know that she was unhappy, for instance, that the script
"updated" the action to contemporary times, and she also felt that at least
one of the girls cast in the film should have been blond, to provide contrast
with the others.  She has written screenplays for some of her novels, but
this wasn't among them.

Greg J.



Date:  Fri, 15 Aug 1997 18:14:40 -0400
From:  "Ralf A. Engeldinger" 
To:  jco@usfca.edu
 Subject:  Re: JCO Film Adaptations

Cyranomish@aol.com wrote:
> 
> I really want to see this Foxfire movie.  It was in Boston for about a week.
>  As soon as I saw a still of the actresses on the JCO home page, I realized
> it had been reset to a cheesy 90s era.  The charm of the book to me was all
> the 50s stuff, so I hesitated and missed out.  Last time I checked the video
> store -- 4 or more months ago, it wasn't out yet. 

I saw the video in a store in New York City (the Village) two weeks ago.
It certainly is out now.

Ralf A. Engeldinger

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Last updated 8-15-97
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